Sensible Erection | New high-speed rail network could trump air travel

Wednesday, 17 March 2010

New high-speed rail network could trump air travel

quote [ China is in negotiations to build a high-speed rail network to India and Europe with trains capable of running at more than 320 kilometres per hour within the next 10 years.

By using the Channel Tunnel, the network would eventually carry passengers from London to Beijing and then to Singapore, according to Wang Mengshu, a member of the Chinese Academy of Engineering and a senior consultant on China's domestic high-speed railways. ]

BTW, anyone have a cached copy of the game that was at keepherawake.com?

http://www.shapeways.com/shops/bathsheba?url=%2Fusershop&rows=10

Unrelated: Edward Gorey paper theatre
http://www.amazon.com/dp/0764945416
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=58tUQkFr5fw

[sci&tech] [by f00m@nB@r@4:16amGMT] [+5 Interesting]

Comments

profetscott said @ 4:46am GMT on 17th Mar
"We would really rather the other countries pay in raw materials instead of bankrolling their portion". That makes too much sense. Is this "for real"

foobar said @ 5:29am GMT on 17th Mar
My bet is yes. It's one of those rare things that are good for pretty much everyone involved. Good to see China stepping up to the development plate.

quaint said @ 4:48am GMT on 17th Mar [Score:2 Funny]

yasha said @ 5:12am GMT on 17th Mar [Score:1 Insightful]
on what planet is "two days by train" almost as fast as "ten hours by airplane?"

f00m@nB@r said @ 5:16am GMT on 17th Mar
I'm guessing not Earth.

foobar said @ 5:25am GMT on 17th Mar
Planet Idonthatemyknees.

Ronin.ca said @ 5:56pm GMT on 17th Mar [Score:1 Insightful]
Also planetyoucanbringwaymoreshitwithyouanduseit...

VIA Rail Canada (Proudly serving those bits of Canada where we can make a profit and ignoring the other bits totally) has wifi. If they can do it, with their halfassed service record... well anyone can. So real wifi. Real plugs (though most planes now have the later), and real space to use the computers.

Honestly though, I think the Euro attitude of transit systems being complimentary is the way to go.

That said, after I've dumped on VIA, if you live in downtown Montreal and are going to downtown Toronto taking the train actually winds up being faster when you factor in the travel and security BS.

teknokracy said @ 7:24am GMT on 18th Mar
To what "other" bits are you referring?

bystander said @ 7:05am GMT on 19th Mar
The parts that aren't Montréal, Toronto, Vancouver, or a city of over 300,000 in between the above.

Oh, and they condescend to go to Halifax, too, once in a while... though they keep trying to cancel the Atlantic runs every 3 years or so.

DirtyBirdy said @ 5:23am GMT on 17th Mar
Give it a few years and there will be 3 days of observation before you're allowed on a plane -- especially one going to a foreign country.

Krutz said @ 6:01am GMT on 17th Mar
Give it one train bombing that damages the rails and the only people allowed on trains will be sedated in plastic "travel pods."

spite48 said @ 7:18am GMT on 17th Mar
Awesome. I'd love to travel sedated in a travel pod.

leezurd said @ 7:30am GMT on 17th Mar
*sigh*

...bend over...

teknokracy said @ 5:24am GMT on 17th Mar
On a planet with no jet fuel left?

sacrelicious said @ 9:27pm GMT on 17th Mar
faster is not necessarily better. on a train you can move around, eat (good food, I mean), see actual scenery, stretch your legs to their fullest, even get your own private sleeper cabin for a little extra.

I'd take two days on a train over ten hours with fuck-all to do in a sitting position crowded in and breathing recycled air on an airplane any day, provided I could spare the extra travel time.

flat_michael said @ 10:12pm GMT on 17th Mar
also, it's tons easier to get it on while riding a train. chugga chugga choo choo!

sacrelicious said @ 10:17pm GMT on 17th Mar
I hope you realize that saying that is enough to put you on the sex offender watchlist.

quaint said @ 6:00am GMT on 18th Mar
You've obviously never been on a morning train from Durham to Newcastle.

I'd take ten hours on an aeroplane over 20 minutes on that.

foobar said @ 5:22am GMT on 17th Mar
BTW, anyone have a cached copy of the game that was at keepherawake.com?

It might be in my cache, but the swf wouldn't do you a bit of good without the video which flash does not cache.

blackpsypher said @ 5:39am GMT on 17th Mar
Makes sense actually. Sounds like they're using a hybrid/electric system which makes sense.

What would make even more sense was if each passenger section was a solar/battery unit with a drive system. You could drop a rear section before a switch and allow it to make it's way into station to disembark and pick up departing sections at the other end with minimal slowing.

Though on current tech, equipping each section of a train system with adequate batteries would be an environmental nightmare....which oddly enough makes it sound perfect for the Chinese.

teknokracy said @ 6:16am GMT on 17th Mar
FWIW trains have been "hybrid" for decades (diesel electric).

All said and done, the power has to come from somewhere, so it's either diesel on the train itself, or electricity generated from (hopefully) clean sources.

todde said @ 7:38am GMT on 17th Mar
Meanwhile the Rethuglicans here have done everything they can to kill passenger rail. We have a rail system that Bulgaria would be ashamed of.

lilmookieesquire said @ 7:51am GMT on 17th Mar
No need for name-calling. The term "Republicans" is insulting enough these days. :p

King of the Hill said @ 3:55pm GMT on 17th Mar
HUH? How about POLITICIANS?

Their idea of high speed rail is throwing billions more of tax payer dollars at Amtrak... Is your idea of high speed rail 90 mph trains that have to slow down every 20 miles?

China, Japan, Europe all have better, if not ideal high speed rail...I've said it here before and I'll say it again...

I'm a conservative, but I'd have no problem with the US gov't investing in TRUE high speed rail infrastructure here. It would create jobs, and be far more efficient for passenger and freight transport.

todde said @ 4:08pm GMT on 17th Mar
Amtrak is chronically under-funded compared to every other form of transportation such as airlines and the highway system. It's always being "streamlined" and "partially privatized" in destructive ways by the automobile and airline lobbyists and Republican congressman who have been bragging for years that they want to destroy it.

Why can't they do real high-speed rail? Among other things Carter-era Republican sabotage of railway reform forbade them from owning their own rails.

King of the Hill said @ 4:39pm GMT on 17th Mar
My point is we need to throw out the idea of "amtrak" and start anew. Let the gov't build the infrastructure and let commercial entities lease rail time/miles to cover the operating costs/maintenance long term.

It would never pay for itself, unless you counted the spin off and interconnected commercial benefits outside of the rail systems itself.

You may point to the republicans wanting to kill Amtrak, but I'd say part of the reason we do not have true high speed rail is the democrats keeping Amtrak on life support all these years.

v21 said @ 8:50pm GMT on 17th Mar [Score:1 Insightful]
Seems to me you need these slower services to link the places the high speed trains don't stop at to the places they do. I mean, I am hugely excited about the dawning of high speed rail, but there's no reason to junk the old decrepit stuff.

King of the Hill said @ 3:33am GMT on 18th Mar
That is what light rail is for...and many larger cities have it already if not planning on having it.

No.. You can't link everywhere with high speed rail, but linking major cities is a no brainer.

v21 said @ 4:19pm GMT on 18th Mar
I am talking about towns between cities. I don't know America, and I know that population density is a few orders of magnitude lower there, but I don't think it's worth building light rail 50 miles out of cities, and I don't think high speed rail should stop every 20 miles (because it's slow). Clearly this is a gap.

(And I DO think all major cities should be linked with high speed rail)

Krutz said @ 2:44am GMT on 18th Mar
The trouble is, for-profit companies hate sharing anything, pretty much, and maintenance? Not exactly their strong suit.

And here's the two biggest problems with high speed rail in this country:

1. It crosses states. Getting them all to agree to pay for it would be pretty phenomenal, as well as who gets what line when. Then there's the nagging problem of where it'll go through our cities. Just about every place considering light rail is having to retrofit the system into existing cityscapes without fucking up existing traffic corridors. You'd have a lot of "conservatives" up in arms about eminent domain, even if you made it an elevated system.
2. What high speed rail system should we use? Which technology is best, and can it survive in all of the various climates we'll run it through?

Sadly, in a country as big as ours, it'd probably have to start out as small branches connecting major metro areas, making it a giant tarball if it ever managed to go across the country. Most likely, barring some kind of enlightened self-interest or monetary motive, we'll never see things like a dedicated line connecting New York to L.A., or even one with only 3 or so stops.

King of the Hill said @ 3:44am GMT on 18th Mar
High Speed rail isn't about linking every conceivable city in the US. Air travel is always going to be best for that New York to LA flight or Miami.

Considering our airports are already over utilized, leveraging high speed rail for the shorter "regional" travel would be more efficient.

Also, light rail already exists in most larger cities which could serve as the dispersal mechanism from the high speed rail station, even if built on the outskirts, like many major airports already are. We also have a significant amount of real estate already tied up in the interstate system and are still leveraging eminent domain for expansion - Just ask the good people living around Charlotte about their new I-485 beltway. Where that beltway runs, numerous commercial, and residential properties went under development, spurring growth, creating jobs... Unfortunately, it also contributes to sprawl, but that is another discussion.

Really, it is just a matter of time before it happens... Cheaper to do it sooner than later. As for the technology, Japan, Europe and China have fairly diverse climates and they have managed to deploy high speed rail successfully. No need to invent our own, but borrow from the best already out there.

teknokracy said @ 7:27am GMT on 18th Mar
Fuck, the whole country can't even decide if they want healthcare or not, how will they ever agree on rail?!

arctan said @ 2:37pm GMT on 18th Mar [Score:1 Funny]
I can already hear Glenn Beck bleating about "train rape panels".

Japanese fisherman said @ 8:06am GMT on 17th Mar
*trains*

jaxtraw's ass said @ 9:32am GMT on 17th Mar
Get away from me!

ScoobySnacks said @ 4:45pm GMT on 17th Mar [Score:1 WTF]

yevishere said @ 7:31pm GMT on 17th Mar
These trains will be able to rape people at almost 400 miles per hour.

Dioxin said @ 7:50pm GMT on 17th Mar
Is that all you can think about? Trains?

rapist said @ 9:21pm GMT on 17th Mar
BUT MACHINES LACK THE PERSONAL TOUCH!!!

the belt said @ 9:05pm GMT on 17th Mar

J-Loser said @ 12:09am GMT on 18th Mar
Fuck, I wish I was 25 again.

pleaides said @ 9:26am GMT on 18th Mar
Trains are cool